Right here is my edited model of the second transcript:

00:00.00

Preston Lee

Hey there and welcome to this Q&A episode of Freelance to Founder. As a lot of you could know we do these query and reply episodes every Tuesday and our full teaching periods with freelancers identical to you on Thursdays. So we’ll do a brief one right now after which we’ll catch you this coming Thursday with a full-length teaching episode. Becoming a member of me on the air right now is Clay Mosley from GetTripify.com. Hey Clay, going properly.

00:23.31

Clay

Man, it’s goin’.

00:31.14

Clay

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However.

00:38.28

Preston Lee

I don’t know, my guess is that this isn’t this individual’s actual title. Whether it is, I’m sorry I laughed nevertheless it’s a, it’s like a cool branded title however I don’t assume it’s an actual title. This query, Clay, although comes from Pennygoo. Pennygoo, so that you inform me, actual title?

00:49.23

Clay

That might be. I imply, it is dependent upon the place this individual’s from. I imply, there are names that may sound uncommon to us.

00:57.10

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Preston Lee

Let’s learn the query right here. It says: “I’d like recommendation on the way to value a contract search engine optimization job for WordPress. I’ve recognized particular issues that should be modified, principally optimizing their graphics. I think about it will solely take a couple of hours however I need to be certain I go away sufficient time in case I hit any snags.”

So I believe for me that is much less about pricing search engine optimization stuff. For those who’re listening and also you don’t do search engine optimization, this I believe goes to open an fascinating dialog extra about pricing.

01:47.24

Clay

Yeah, yeah, yeah, and actually rapidly, what’s the twenty second model of why we are saying don’t do hourly?

01:57.34

Preston Lee

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You mentioned you will have ideas. First, don’t cost by the hour. I believe that’s fairly clear in case you’ve ever watched or listened to our episodes. So many occasions we are saying don’t do hourly as a result of as human beings, we relate hourly to low-cost. Take into consideration all the roles on this planet and who will get paid hourly and who will get paid wage. What’s the distinction, proper? You may put that collectively.

02:25.87

Clay

And for me, it’s additionally the piece of, you get punished for being higher. For those who get paid hourly, so in case you’re sooner, in case you’re extra environment friendly, you get punished as a result of it takes you much less time.

02:47.33

Preston Lee

Yeah, yeah. That’s true. The one, the one factor I hate although is that he justifies it. He’s like, “Properly I went to school and realized the place to hit it and I practiced within the discipline for 20 years and realized the place to hit it,” no matter. For me, it’s like that stuff doesn’t matter. What issues is you pay, you agreed to pay me 50 grand to get your boat shifting once more. That’s what you care about, getting your boat shifting.

03:16.97

Preston Lee

Yep yep. You get punished for being higher in case you get paid hourly.

03:26.10

Clay

Sure, properly it jogs my memory of, there’s a meme or one thing on the web the place this huge cruise ship is damaged. You understand what I’m speaking about? Okay, so there’s an enormous ship, some form of ship, huge boat, that’s damaged and the captain says we haven’t been in a position to repair it so we’re gonna rent you for, I keep in mind the quantity, nevertheless it was like $20,000 or no matter, 50,000, you’ll be able to title it. Anyway, it’s a high value and the man’s like “Okay, I may repair it.” It’s like 50 grand and the captain’s like “Okay nice” and he actually, the mechanic, actually takes a hammer, hits it as soon as and says “It’s fastened” and it was fastened. And the man was like “Okay I’m not going to pay 50 grand for that.”

04:15.80

Preston Lee

Yeah, okay.

04:20.20

Clay

And the mechanic’s like “Properly I spent 10 years studying the place to hit the hammer proper?” Despite the fact that it solely took me one hit, it’s value 50 grand, proper? So in case you charged hourly, you’ll be able to’t actually do this.

04:26.33

Preston Lee

Yeah.

04:32.82

Preston Lee

I really like that story and I’ve heard all kinds of variations now that you simply defined it.

05:41.74

Clay

That is what doesn’t make sense with the authorized trade, proper? Like why would you pay a divorce legal professional an hourly fee? They’re incentivized to verify your divorce will get drawn out, proper? That doesn’t make any sense to me. Anyway, let’s transfer on.

05:56.59

Preston Lee

However you mentioned you will have ideas. First, don’t cost by the hour. Do you will have every other ideas?

06:11.27

Clay

Yep. To be truthful too, I additionally went on a tangent. Um, yeah I do. Challenge pricing. And I believe this actually is dependent upon provide and demand. I imply how booked are you? Which is demand, proper? And the way a lot provide do you will have, which is your time? If in case you have high demand and low provide, you need to cost higher. If it’s the other, you need to cost decrease, for my part.

06:46.50

Preston Lee

Yep.

06:53.96

Preston Lee

For me that is additionally, we at all times have individuals saying, ought to I cost by the hour, by the undertaking, and what that excludes is the choice of charging by the value that you simply present. Take into account that is your shopper, proper? They usually have some form of search engine optimization job. Let’s contemplate only for illustration, essentially the most excessive state of affairs. Okay, so let’s say this search engine optimization job, all of their articles on their website that they use to generate new enterprise for his or her firm, all of their articles dropped to the second web page of Google which nobody ever goes to, proper? Let’s say that’s the issue. Pennygoo is employed now to resolve that downside. How a lot is that downside being solved value to this firm, even when she fees $150 an hour?

07:36.46

Clay

Yeah.

07:50.35

Preston Lee

If she will resolve that downside in 10 hours, that’s solely $1500. Relying on the corporate, that downside being solved is value far more than that. You understand what I imply? You must generally step again and never even say by the undertaking or by the hour. You must say, what is that this really value? It’s that complete thought of the ship shifting. What’s it value to get this ship shifting once more, no matter what it takes?

08:16.20

Clay

Yeah I believe it’s a mindframe factor, proper? It’s just like the purchasers who take a look at prices primarily based on period, how lengthy it’s going to take. I believe these individuals usually have a tough time with enterprise progress. It’s a distinction in mindframe. If I had been speaking to anyone about, let’s say, search engine optimization providers they usually have an issue on the second web page, they should be on the primary web page, what does that work to them, proper? So if I had been speaking to these individuals I wouldn’t ask them what number of hours are you keen to pay? That’s a a lot totally different state of affairs versus “Hey in case you may write a test proper now and this downside might be solved tomorrow, what’s that value to you? What does that work to what you are promoting and your backside line?” That’s a a lot totally different query as a result of now it takes the time equation out. And now you’ll be able to principally write your personal test, for my part.

09:25.35

Preston Lee

Yeah, and that turns into a clumsy query to ask, proper? You must work out the way to ask that query however otherwise, as a result of it’s like once you go to purchase furnishings or a automotive, they usually ask “Properly what’s your funds?” You don’t need to inform them your funds as a result of then they only discover proper as much as your funds.

09:45.60

Clay

Yeah, yeah.

09:54.21

Preston Lee

The best way you’ll ask that is like “How a lot income, in case you needed to guess, how a lot of your income comes from Google?” And let’s say “Oh properly we do 1,000,000 {dollars} in income a 12 months. $300,000 of it’s immediately from Google.” After which at that time you’ll be able to determine it out.

10:19.23

Clay

Yeah.

10:19.54

Preston Lee

Precisely. And also you ask these questions amid a lot of different questions you’re asking to study extra about their enterprise. It’s not apparent you’re making an attempt to find out numbers and pricing.

10:38.33

Preston Lee

And now as a result of we’ve dropped to web page two, we’re not getting that and it equates to, yeah, $300,000 a 12 months or one thing. And then you definitely’re tapping into that as a freelancer going, oh it is a $300,000 downside for them. To cost them $10,000 for this, if I can ship on it, is nothing, proper?

10:45.19

Clay

Yeah, yep.

10:53.66

Clay

Nothing, yeah, and it’s your job – that is good previous gross sales coaching too – I’ve had tons of gross sales coaching and that is what you’re tapping into is the feelings. So I believe you’ll be able to even go additional and ask the individual, “Okay, it is a $300,000 downside probably. What would occur if what you are promoting was diminished by $300,000 a 12 months?” I might say it like that. “What would occur?” After which they will go into issues like, “Properly, we’d have to put off staff or we would must shut our enterprise down.” Now you’re stepping into feelings after which you’ll be able to cost a very high ticket.

11:38.66

Preston Lee

Yeah.

11:49.55

Preston Lee

I believe it’s necessary to grasp that this isn’t manipulative or sleazy gross sales techniques. I believe it’s understanding your value. When individuals say perceive your value and cost what you’re value, that is what they imply, proper? The place in case you can resolve a $300,000 downside for $10,000, you’re offering a implausible service. Nowhere else in enterprise are you able to spend $10,000 and make $300,000. You simply, it’s remarkable, proper?

12:19.69

Clay

Yeah.

12:24.40

Preston Lee

It’s necessary to grasp the place you fall in that chain of income, new clients. That is simple for advertising and marketing areas like search engine optimization. Typically it may be more durable, like if I’m a graphic designer and a shopper needs me for every day social media posts, it’s more durable to justify. However that’s your job as a freelancer, as a salesman, as a marketer, to get to the purpose the place you’ll be able to say this factor I’m providing is value $5,000, $10,000, no matter you determine. You must be daring and brave in that option to give pricing like that.

13:07.10

Clay

Yeah.

13:14.30

Clay

I believe it’s ironic as a result of some individuals would possibly assume it’s sleazy, however I disagree. The shopper keen to pay $10,000 to repair a $300,000 downside, they don’t assume it’s sleazy. They’re pleased to jot down that test. The individuals who do assume it’s sleazy are normally individuals in your career who cost a fraction of the value they usually’re simply pissed that they didn’t get the job, for my part. Once I was doing web sites, I used to be charging twelve, fifteen thousand {dollars} a website, for a reasonably normal brochure website. You might discover a freelancer to construct the identical factor for a thousand or much less. The distinction is, I’ve a model title and belief issue and I’m good at gross sales. Individuals value that.

14:22.26

Preston Lee

It’s about figuring out what individuals value, proper? Worth-based pricing is the toughest to start out with, however as soon as you work that out, it may possibly actually change what you are promoting and assist you to take a look at pricing in an entire new manner. You’re proper, the thought of a sleazy salesperson principally comes from these of us on the gross sales facet who’re designers, writers, illustrators first, after which understand as a freelancer we now have to do gross sales. We expect gross sales is slimy. However in case you’re including value, sure that prices cash, and other people count on that.

15:05.80

Clay

Yeah.

15:12.97

Clay

Yeah.

15:17.26

Preston Lee

Hopefully Pennygoo, that was useful. I’ve been Preston Lee from Millo.co and this has been a Q&A episode of Freelance to Founder. Thanks for listening, see you subsequent time.

15:22.16

Clay

Cool.

15:35.86

Preston Lee

Thanks, Clay.